Scammer - WhiteLotus - AIM: WhiteLotusTR - Chargeback after rating completion

[SpecializedMMO]

Information
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Date that scamming took place: January 28, 2011
Method of Contact Used: AIM
Instant Messenger ID of scammer: WhiteLotusTR
Your Instant Messenger ID: ArenaRating
MMOBAY Account of Scammer: WhiteLotus
Other information: First and foremost, we have been at MMOBay/MD for over a year now and we have never ever had a problem with any customer. We treat everyone fairly and with respect. I feel very used to be honest for someone to try to pull someone like this. Again, our stay at MB has been amazing, and have really never had any problems or issues, so I'm new to this whole scammer thread thing, help would be appreciated. Additionally, we would appreciate if the negative feedback be removed from our name if the decision goes our way (which I'm sure it will with the amount of proof we have provided). Thank you.


Scam Information
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What was scammed?: Customer has purchased 2200 Rating + T2 weapon. As most of you know, T2 weapon was removed from the game by Blizzard until a later time. The rating was achieved right away, we were waiting on Blizzard's release of T2 weapon in order for the customer to receive it. We promised him a week of free games, but we learned that Blizzard's intentions to release the weapons on January 25 has changed (since they don't want PvP to have better weapons than PvE's progression at its current state). Granted I told him we would play sometimes to cap out his points, the plans had changed after we had news that T2 Weapons were NOT going to be released on January 25, 2011.

Link of trade thread: link the thread of what you or they were trading, if any: http://vbforums.mmobay.net/professional-gaming-buying-sales-services/354663-season-9-arena-leveling|-2900-glads-|cheapest-md-verified|-arenarating-com.html
Approximate value of scammed property: $435.00 USD

Was a middleman used?: No
If yes, who?:
Describe how you were scammed: The customer, WhiteLotusTR, paid for his 2200 + T2 Weapon (in 3v3). ArenaRating successfully completed his rating despite his horrible gear and previously using the conquest points we farmed for him towards his T2 Weapon to upgrade his gear. Since then, he tried contacting me once on January 13, 2011 and have not heard from him since. Last night, I logged on Paypal only to see a dispute filed by him. Thus, he received partial of his order (and this is only due to Blizzard's limitation). Once he received a part of his order, he filed a chargeback, trying to get free 2200 rating in 3v3.

Other details / notes:

Proof
Proof You MUST provide proof or your claim will not be valid!
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Chat Logs: Use

tags.
This is the last conversation I had from him, dated December 31, 2010 at 7:37PM. Note that I was getting ready for New Years here and stepped away from the computer, I had not heard back from him for a while, and I just spoke again to him on January 24, 2011. I have plenty of AIMs from him never stating that he was unhappy with the service and wanted a refund. There were plenty of times he wanted to "change the class we were playing" and wanted a refund, but never unhappy with anything we did. I will be happy to post all AIMLogs if needed.

Dec 31st Chat:
7:37:47 PM WhiteLotusTR: hey man, i noticed you guys his 2207, very nice job..
7:37:53 PM ArenaRating: yes
7:37:54 PM ArenaRating: lol
7:38:13 PM WhiteLotusTR: what are your plans for the t2 weapon atm? since they delayed it
7:38:19 PM WhiteLotusTR: to the 25th i think?
7:43:38 PM ArenaRating: just wiat until the 25th i suppose
7:43:41 PM ArenaRating: i mean youll hve the points
7:46:01 PM WhiteLotusTR: doesn't it take 3400?
7:46:08 PM WhiteLotusTR: thought thats what i read on mmochampion
7:47:36 PM WhiteLotusTR: i was thinking at a rate of like 2000 points or whatever we're getting, its essentially a little bit under 2 weeks
7:48:16 PM WhiteLotusTR: so maybe we could do weekly points that i pay for the first couple weeks, and then the 2 weeks prior to the 25th could be part of the package i bought?
7:48:46 PM WhiteLotusTR: let me know what you want to do
10:53:20 PM WhiteLotusTR: did u get my messages bud?

January 24th Chat:
WhiteLotusTR (10:42:24 PM):hey man, i was just wondering what was happening with my order... any updates?
ArenaRating (10:42:34 PM): Yeah whats up? I thought we had the amount of pts ready to go
WhiteLotusTR (10:43:09 PM):i dunno a couple weeks ago u said they were gonna play but they didn't, and left the team.. so i wasn't sure what was going on.. haven't logged in in like 3 weeks cuz i wanted to make it available for u guys
WhiteLotusTR (10:43:24 PM):i rly dont know whats going on...
WhiteLotusTR (10:44:03 PM):i hate to be a pest so i haven't rly msg'd you about it, but i figured its almost the 25th so it was worth asking
ArenaRating (10:44:44 PM): you left the 2200 team?
WhiteLotusTR (10:44:57 PM):no i haven't even logged on, i just noticed everyone else did
ArenaRating (10:45:03 PM): yeah we'd play in2 s
ArenaRating (10:45:04 PM): not 3s
ArenaRating (10:45:06 PM): to cap you out
WhiteLotusTR (10:45:10 PM):oic
ArenaRating (10:45:16 PM): you're good we're gonna play
WhiteLotusTR (10:45:41 PM):ok cool, just figured i'd ask... i was gettin kinda worried that something went wrong or miscommunication
ArenaRating (10:46:00 PM): no worries
WhiteLotusTR (10:46:05 PM):thx man ^_^

Pictures/Screenshots: Link to pictures or use code.

Here is a screenshot I took of the armory just in case he leaves the team:
[IMG]http://img51.imageshack.us/img51/3046/armoryz.jpg

Here's an in game screenshot that we took after we completed the 2200 rating:
(notice that we capped out his points at 2064/2064 and there is only 650 of that left. We had done this for 2 weeks, so imagine how many points he has already spent. According to this screenshot, he has already spent 1459 points.

Paypal Screenshot of dispute:
Other proof:

Additional Information
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Did you do any background searching before the trade?: Yes
Have you traded with this person before?: Yes
Approximately how many trades have you done on MMOBAY?: Over 150+

 

[EpicNPC]

WhiteLotus has been notified

As previously announced (http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/to...7814533?page=1), Conquest items requiring 2200 rating were made available today, January 25, with the exception of weapons. We plan to make the 2200 weapons available approximately two weeks after the release of patch 4.0.6.

The screenshot does show a 2200+ rating and according to blizzard the T2 items are going to pushed back to a date that has not yet been announced.

I removed the screenshots because they show the players username. Please cover that up and re-upload them.

Feedback quote from WhiteLotusT

These guys may have been good arena levelers in previous seasons, but they have had a serious dropout as of late.

They constantly delay their services over and over again, make excuses for not getting things done in a timely manner and say they will do things on so and so date - and they never do. I ordered the T2 weapon + 2200 package on 12/17/10 and still to this day I am 2800 points short of buying the weapon. I have contacted them on AIM multiple times every week to ask when my account will be worked on and why it hasn't been touched in weeks. I'm always told, "oh you don't have enough points?" and they act surprised every time I talk to them. I'm assured they will play "tomorrow" and yet, still weeks later and the account hasn't even been touched. I added a game card in good faith that they would play the following week and once again my trust was betrayed as they haven't played since shortly after the new year.

Whoever is in charge of the AIM ArenaRating has very poor communication and tends to ignore messages/concerns you have with the order as well. This has honestly been the worst transaction I've ever had on Markee/MMOBay; so much so that I requested a refund for the portion of the service that wasn't finished and I was denied on the basis that it was "more than half way done" at the time and they couldn't refund it (at 1600 rating, really? thats only a few games played). I was told to contact the owner of the website and he never even responded to my IM's once. What a poor policy when you're obviously delivering such a sub par service.

I was very skeptical of trying their service and I regret ever buying it now. I would highly recommend not using their services as your order may never even be finished (just as mine will never be finished). I have done absolutely nothing to aggravate these guys or anything, I have been totally courteous and given them full control of the account for over a month and have been totally let down. They even said I was a "totally understanding and a great customer" on multiple occasions. Why take advantage of me then? What a bad situation to be in.

I've given up on it ever being worked on again.

Im confused about a few things here. How are you short 2800 points when these weapons only require 2200? The screenshot shows 2207, where do you see 1600?

 

[drewdenman]

Banned - possible hacked account - used in a scam - http://www.epicnpc.com/scammers/448501-possible-scammer-drewdenman.html

Im confused about a few things here. How are you short 2800 points when these weapons only require 2200? The screenshot shows 2207, where do you see 1600?

Sorry, I know this has nothing to do here, but but points he mean the actual Conquest Points you gain and need to purchase the weapon. His Arena rating was 2207, but that gives 1122 a week (as long as the rating is 2207 every week and the minimum number of games are played every week.) To buy the T2 weapon, I think its 3400 Conquest Points.

---------- Post added 01-29-2011 at 05:10 PM ----------

EDIT 1: Oh and when they say 2200 weapons, they mean a personal rating of 2200 be had in order to use the weapon, not that it is 2200 points.

 

[EpicNPC]

I see, thanks for the explanation.

 

[SpecializedMMO]

Sorry, I know this has nothing to do here, but but points he mean the actual Conquest Points you gain and need to purchase the weapon. His Arena rating was 2207, but that gives 1122 a week (as long as the rating is 2207 every week and the minimum number of games are played every week.) To buy the T2 weapon, I think its 3400 Conquest Points.

---------- Post added 01-29-2011 at 05:10 PM ----------

EDIT 1: Oh and when they say 2200 weapons, they mean a personal rating of 2200 be had in order to use the weapon, not that it is 2200 points.

The original post has been edited to take out the user's character name.

Couple of things to clarify:

1) 2207 rating gives over 2500 points a week.
2) We promised we would play one week (for a free additional week of points, but we did not do that yet because the weapons were pushed back). We should have clarified this with him to avoid confusion.
3) There were conquest points already used that improved his gear (which should have gone towards his purchase).
4) How can we even finish an order if blizzard decided to take out T2 of the game, I don't see what we've done wrong here? -- He never stated he just wanted 3400 points way before the release of T2 weapons.
5) He asked for a refund (not because he was not happy with the service) but because he wanted to change the character he purchased the rating on because "warriors might not be good for too long." Our policy states once we finish 50% of the rating, you cannot ask for a refund. Again, this was all fabricated by him, he never once showed his frustration nor concern so I could address any of his issues that he had.

To WhiteLotus: It was amazing dealing with your order last season, as things went smoothly. Again this season, things were going smooth (Blizzard hasn't even released the t2 weapon yet). I'm shocked that you would even fabricate so much information to 1) tarnish our name and 2) scourge yourself to free rating and a free weapon. I'm honestly EXTREMELY disappointed that you out of all people would do this. I'm not entirely sure how I "used" you or you say I never responded back to you on AIM. Come on man, you know this is 100% untrue. If you're going to complain about how I handled things at least just say the truth... The only thing I am wrong in is making the mistake in not clarifying with you that we were going to play at a closer date when the T2 weapon is going to be released. Hence last time I spoke to you, I said, "Don't worry, we'll play." If you just wanted 3400 BEFORE the release of t2 weapon, you should have just told us that you were unhappy and wanted the points before hand. How can you say your order is never (nor is) going to be completed when T2 weapons aren't even in the game? Completely immature to do something like this.

You kept saying that I was never on AIM or responded, this only happened ONCE, I have numerous of AIM logs responding to you every single time you messaged me. I would say "your don't have enough points?" because you had spent some of them for armor pieces (and please don't deny this).

Additionally, your feedback says "We delay, make excuses, and offer no compensation." Again, this is untrue. I can have plenty of customers post here about how many times if their order was slowed down we would offer them something for free (either a week of free points or discount on their next purchase). The only reason your order took longer is because your gear was one of the worst we've ever had to play on (and you know this as well, and we still tried to be there for you as much as possible). There is so much fabrication in your feedback that its truly shocking.

 

[WhiteLotus]

For everyone's information, I'm only asking for a $130 refund from PayPal for the 2 weeks worth of points that i was short for the T2 weapon - I filed that amount in the resolution center stating I would remove negative feedback on MMOBay and close the dispute upon successful receipt of said amount. It would have been nice to know your plans instead of just ignoring me for weeks on end. You did indeed get the 2200 rating which I told PayPal you did get for me, and was told by you that your guys were going to play shortly after new years, nothing. Asked you on AIM again what was going on, you said they would play tomorrow, again nothing. My account expired, I put on a new game card in good faith you would play and gave it a week or so to see what would happen. Nothing again. Messaged you again as in our quoted conversation in the original post and was told you would play 2's and once again nothing was touched.

If you would have at least said SOMETHING (I do have offline messages enabled on AIM, received nothing from you at all) to me for those weeks where you stated you would play and in fact did not even log in my account, this wouldn't have ever happened. The fact that I was left in the dark being told over and over again it would be done only when I contacted you, and never was done, even when I told you I didn't have enough points yet - led me to believe I was being strung along.

I do not want a refund of $435, you got me my 2200 rating and that's fine. I want a refund for what wasn't finished which was 2 weeks worth of points for the 3400 conquest point T2 weapon at $65/week as shown on your website. Just because the weapons weren't in game doesn't mean you couldn't have played all the times you said you were going to and accumulated the points. On armory, my toon hadn't even been logged in since January 3rd as of yesterday. Totally unacceptable. Your website shows an ETA of 3 weeks for a 2200 and T2 weapon, and being told nothing for weeks on end after 6 weeks is a sign of complete incompetence as a customer service source. As a matter of fact, 2 of the 4 ratings left for you since October of last year are negative. You were great in the past, I do not deny this, but something is seriously wrong this season and I don't know what it is.

I have no negative feelings towards you, I just want out. This is ridiculous.

---------- Post added 01-29-2011 at 11:08 PM ----------

I don't know if you fully read the PayPal case before posting this, but I'm in total shock you would think I was trying to pull a fast one on you after everything you have put me through as a customer. I was nothing but extremely patient with you. I waited weeks not hearing a word from you, about anything. I contacted you multiple times asking what the progress was, was told you would play on multiple occasions, and every time nothing resulted from that. It's only natural for someone in my position to assume that things are not right when you get no feedback when plans change without my knowledge. There were many more attempted conversations that you never replied to or even told me you were going to play the next day that you conveniently left out to sway the story in your favor as well. I'm very disappointed that you would go this route when all I wanted is what I paid for.

---------- Post added 01-29-2011 at 11:19 PM ----------

"notice that we capped out his points at 2064/2064 and there is only 650 of that left. We had done this for 2 weeks, so imagine how many points he has already spent. According to this screenshot, he has already spent 1459 points."

Are you serious? You never capped me for two weeks after purchasing the T1 weapon; never once did this happen. This is not true in the slightest. I spent no points, you can check my characters logs for equipment I've purchased. I have NOTHING other than the two items you bought for me. Your leveler purchased the range item and forgot to return it as you told me on AIM and that is how we ended up at 650 from the original 1300-1400 we had banked after purchasing the weapon (as the range runs around ~700 if I recall). How it got that way is your business and not mine, I made no purchases whatsoever throughout this entire experience. Please don't fabricate stories to make yourself look better. I'm obviously not trying to devalue your reputation or scam you; I've been a part of MD since 2007 with 100% feedback/TWV and only want a refund for the 2 weeks @ $65/week that I was not provided.

---------- Post added 01-29-2011 at 11:43 PM ----------

Look, I really have nothing else to say on the matter. You are not a bad guy, I do not dislike you or your business, I think you guys did a fantastic job on the 2200 rating. I realize we ran into a few bumps at 1650 and then later at 2000, and I have no problem with that. The thing I have a problem with is being left in the dark when things change and getting any sort of response is like pulling teeth. Even in the quote you listed above, you see me asking, "Did you get my messages bud?" and I never did receive a response... that is the exact thing I'm talking about. That happened so many times throughout this past month and a half, I've never had that much trouble talking to anyone before and it really frustrated the hell out of me. With the 45 day timer on my PayPal resolution tick-tocking away, I felt it was in my best interest to try and get a refund for the unfinished portion of the order, as from my perspective, I was being told one thing week by week and not seeing any results from what I was told was going to happen over and over again.

---------- Post added 01-29-2011 at 11:46 PM ----------

And as I previously mentioned, I have NO PROBLEM removing the negative feedback and closing the case if I could get compensated for what has yet to be done. I stated this very clearly to PayPal in my claim and will state the same here for both your and the mods review.

 

[SpecializedMMO]

WhiteLotus -

The paypal claim was empty. Had I known this all of this information, we would have never made a scammer post in the first place and would have contacted you on AIM; however, you were not online for the past 24 hours (at least to my knowledge).

Again, nothing against you either, but you never once contacted me since December 31 you contacted me 13 days later, and then again another 2 weeks later. We have so many methods of communication (including phone) and was not sure that you needed the points PRIOR to the t2 weapon to be released. I know you had asked if we would cap out your points, and I always told you we would.

I do admit my wrongdoing in never specifying when we would play and replied with "Don't worry we will play." I should have been clear and stated, "We will play before the T2 weapons are out."

We have been doing this for all of our T2 orders, no one had a problem with it, if you would have just told me "Listen Joe, I really want my points finished (even if the t2 weapon is not out)" we would have had no problem finishing the points. Again, it is my mistake, I should have been more clear in when the games would be played.

However, I don't think you should say I never responded to you AIM, because I did. And for you to say that "this is the worst transaction you have ever dealt with on MMOBay," it's just hurtful because we did so much to help you out and really finished your rating quickly despite the gear you had. I guess I'm just shocked at everything because I never thought we would ever have a problem with your order since everything was going smooth.

Please contact me via AIM, E-Mail, or Phone and let me know what you would like to do. We can do the following:

1) Cap off our points and offer you 2 weeks of free points after that. (Yes, we will play this time before T2, now that everything is clear).
2) Refund you the remaining money.


Thanks.

 

[WhiteLotus]

Talking to you now.

 

[SpecializedMMO]

issue has been resolved.

 

[WhiteLotus]

Was refunded the $130 after a very professional encounter with Mr. ArenaRating. I would greatly appreciate it if the admin/mods could remove my negative feedback and my post from his arena thread located on page 60 here ASAP: http://vbforums.mmobay.net/professi...cheapest-md-verified|-arenarating-com-60.html

Thank you for being such a gentleman about the situation, you are really a great guy in the end.

 

[SpecializedMMO]

Was refunded the $130 after a very professional encounter with Mr. ArenaRating. I would greatly appreciate it if the admin/mods could remove my negative feedback and my post from his arena thread located on page 60 here ASAP: http://vbforums.mmobay.net/professional-gaming-buying-sales-services/354663-season-9-arena-leveling|-2900-glads-|cheapest-md-verified|-arenarating-com-60.html

Thank you for being such a gentleman about the situation, you are really a great guy in the end.

Thank you for being understanding and we all apologize for the misunderstanding that took place.

If in the future you ever feel you need anything, you have 30% off any item we sell. I'll personally make sure to take extra care of your order this time. Thank you again.