False Feedback by Delusional 12 Year Old

Upwards · May 24, 2023

https://www.epicnpc.com/threads/upwards-is-a-scammer-paypal-charebcak-fraud.2521576/#post-9052634

Just review this to see proof there is no scam happening.. man literally has all of his accounts and my money still I'm literally charging back to get my money back because he refuses to refund me.

It's a bit annoying dealing with this yapping ape but please for the love of God give me my money back and get this delusional child away from me. It's ridiculous I even have a Warning when I'm the one with literally nothing in my possession.

EpicNPC CM · May 24, 2023

@Ginger

GENR · May 24, 2023

@EpicNPC CM Thank you for your time, this person changed the terms of sale randomly, he originally owed me $280 the agreement was an Infernal pure osrs acc for a previous acc I sold him successfully and he adds $280 LTC crypto, so, in essence, he owed me $280, after I simply asked him a question "when is your next pay cheque" he proceeds to say I am "hounding" him for his money when I asked a question respectfully.

Currently, I am negative in my PayPal balance and he scammed me and attempted to give me the acc back against my own will when he had no valid basis to do that, he is finding an excuse to get back his money fraudulently using a previous transaction that has nothing to do with this new agreement.

I never did anything wrong to him, and I never lied or hurt him, he is the one who went ahead and disputed it the same second he "changed his mind" as he explains it.

If there is anything else that is needed please let me know, thank you

Upwards · May 24, 2023

@EpicNPC CM There's a whole post with this bull ****, but basically at the end of the day through and through...
He has 2 accounts, the original AGS Pure (which he has secured) and the Infernal Pure (which he never gave me the security info for just a password change).
I told him I would be giving him his accounts back because he was indeed hounding me for money after an agreement we had.

There is no scam taking place here, I told him exactly what would happen if he refused to refund AFTER taking his accounts back and he refused.
This poor kid is delusional and does not understand what a scammer is.

GENR · May 24, 2023

@EpicNPC CM Apologies I am new, and not sure what you want me to state exactly. if it is in regards to the negative feedback Upwards left me, I did it to warn others because I feel taken advantage of and scammed, however, it is good to note that he changed his original feedback on my thread and posted another negative feedback just out of spite because I made the scam report by the advice of other staff members.

The thread can be found here: https://www.epicnpc.com/threads/⭐-maxed-inferal-pure-⭐.2506866/

In the thread, above^^ he makes contradicting statements, he originally was happy and satisfied and this whole dispute only happened because he " changed his mind" I never scammed him or hurt him in anyway shape or form, and simply because I made the report he left the negative feedbacks, he wanted not only to gain the money on Paypal fraudulently but also wanted me to shut up about it.. so another staff member advised me to make the report ASAP

Upwards · May 24, 2023

He's sent me tons of messages begging me to take the AGS Pure back (which I don't want to do business with him anymore) and that he will add X amount of gold pieces but at the end of it all I don't want to do business with this person anymore.

I want my money back, and my feedback will be changed to neutral. I'm not going to keep doing this childish stuff with him. It's a simple refund me my money because you have all your stuff.

Upwards · May 24, 2023

Ginger said:
"he wanted not only to gain the money on Paypal fraudulently but also wanted me to shut up about it.. so another staff member advised me to make the report ASAP"

He has both of his accounts in his possession, I really think this person is delusional. Please give me my refund on my money I will not be doing any business with you.

Upwards · May 24, 2023

Feedback was changed appropriately as the member was kind in the deal at the beginning and promised to help and assist with whatever but quickly 180'ed at the sight of me not bending to his will.

I kept the original feedback for the first account I bought from him because that deal WENT GREAT and he was so kind at the time. Now I'm being refused a refund and that is where my negative feedback for him comes from. Again once I get my money back and I told him this I would change my feedback because then everything is settled but the member is delusional and stuck on the fact I scammed him even when I have nothing to show for the "scam" I did.

May I also add this member is fairly new and I've been on this website well since 2021 with zero issues via Paypal.

GENR · May 24, 2023

WARNING! Off-site contact information posted. We do not investigate disputes if you communicate off-site.

GENR · May 24, 2023

Upwards said:
Feedback was changed appropriately as the member was kind in the deal at the beginning and promised to help and assist with whatever but quickly 180'ed at the sight of me not bending to his will.

I kept the original feedback for the first account I bought from him because that deal WENT GREAT and he was so kind at the time. Now I'm being refused a refund and that is where my negative feedback for him comes from. Again once I get my money back and I told him this I would change my feedback because then everything is settled but the member is delusional and stuck on the fact I scammed him even when I have nothing to show for the "scam" I did.

May I also add this member is fairly new and I've been on this website well since 2021 with zero issues via Paypal.

Also a side note, it is very apparent and obvious but clearly he is either really that self-centered as a person or just trolling at this point but I will leave it to staff to handle, There is absolutely no excuse for your unethical methods and your unprofessionalism as a so-called "experienced seller"

Putting a label on me as "new" and getting on your high horse and saying you are from "2021" doesn't change the fact that what you did is wrong so please have some decency and at least admit the way you approached the situation was disgusting and unprofessional

anyways, I will not spam or argue with you in this thread, if staff need anything please let me know,

Thank you @EpicNPC CM

Upwards · May 24, 2023

It's pretty disgusting that he has to dramatize the whole situation. I remember being 12 as well.
I don't feel comfortable in this deal with him and it's why I would like my money back and again he has everything in his possession.

When you tell someone to refund you after you've already secured all your assets and you decline, and they tell you they will open up a dispute that is not a scam. That is maturity and transparency at it's finest.
You offered the account back as a last ditch effort after making nasty comments and hounding me and I told you no because you're being disgusting and forceful and I was not comfortable anymore.

My comfort in MY money comes first to me. As a seller you should be well aware that your clients need to be comfortable in your deals otherwise you've failed as a seller.

If any of my clients wanted a refund for any reason, they would get it. That is called being a good person, and a good seller. I'm sorry you failed at being ethical and honorable and have resorted to belittling and trying to defame me on this website. You keep messaging me on the side trying to force a deal because you know I'm not bending to your tactics. You're desperate to force this deal on me and you're desperate to try and make me seem like the bad person. Anyone reading this is well aware of what a **** you are being. You have both of your accounts AND my money, and you're saying I'm scamming you. That is insanity.

EDIT: Member can keep spamming that what I did was "wrong" but its just a front to make himself believe he is right. It's simple Psychology 101 stuff, tell yourself something enough times and you'll begin to believe it.

GENR · May 24, 2023

@EpicNPC CM

TOS(TERMS OF SALE): THE ACCOUNT WAS PROVIDED, AND HE PLAYED FOR 2-3 DAYS, AS WE HAD AN AGREEMENT, YESTERDAY HE PROCEEDED TO "CHANGE HIS MIND" AND REFUND THE MONEY ON PAYPAL WITHOUT MY CONSENT.

Whether he played the account for an hour or day or a week, the outcome is the same, we had an agreement and no he is making excuses saying "not comfortable" or "changed my mind" or "made up my mind" is no valid grounds to forcefully refund something that isn't rightfully his..

This is just a summary, he can feel and say whatever he wants respectfully but the facts are clear, I trusted him and took Paypal G/S as he had feedback and a so-called "experienced seller" Clearly I was wrong and it is my own fault for trusting him.

He agreed to pay me $140 LTC every pay cheque which would amount to $280 total, this is in summary what is going on, if anything else is needed or any clarity is needed please let me know,

Ginger

Upwards · May 24, 2023

There were no written rules of ToS and you don't have a ToS in any of your posts.. delusions again. Go edit them real quick though or start adding them, please.

Upwards · May 24, 2023

Verbal agreement =/= ToS
Only legally binding in certain situations and meeting the right criteria.
Also that stuff goes out of the window when deals are consistently being switched and changed around and accounts are back in your possession.

Just refund my money and move on with your miserable life lol

Upwards · May 24, 2023

Anyway, I'm actually done posting on this.
@EpicNPC CM he admits to having both of the accounts and I want my money back since he has both of his assets and I have nothing to show for it.

There is no deal here anymore, the seller has compromised his own integrity and I refuse to purchase from him.

Thanks for taking the time to deal with this nonsense.

GENR · May 24, 2023

Upwards said:
Verbal agreement =/= ToS
Only legally binding in certain situations and meeting the right criteria.
Also that stuff goes out of the window when deals are consistently being switched and changed around and accounts are back in your possession.

Just refund my money and move on with your miserable life lol

Here is the TOS(agreement):

$140 every 2 weeks and gave him until the end of June, he agreed to a regular maxed pure and $280 LTC for my infernal pure, this was the agreement he blatantly lies about, he randomly changes his mind and wants to commit fraud and play the victim card, I will leave staff to decide, he knows exactly what he is doing and he shouldn't be able to take advantage of someone innocent to play his own malicious narrative.

@EpicNPC CM @The Integrity

Upwards · May 24, 2023

You never once stated I couldn’t refund it. You never said all sales are final.
You don’t have a ToS that is just a verbal agreement we had. Again, you are just spinning off on your own narrative. Please try harder

Upwards · May 24, 2023

ToS example
Account is bought as is and info is given.
ALL SALES ARE FINAL NO REFUNDS WILL BE GIVEN UNLESS ACCOUNT IS RETURNED IN 48 HOURS TIME UNALTERED.

Any bans, offences compromise refund eligibility.

There you go bud.

Adoxia · May 24, 2023

Only staff can view this content.

GENR · May 24, 2023

Begging people for Feedback to boost to overshadow what he has done and continuing to do, if any more information is needed please let me know

Upwards · May 24, 2023

Ginger said:
*Staff-Only Content*

Beginning people for Feedback to boost to overshadow what he has done and continuing to do, if anymore information is needed please let me know *Staff-Only Content**Staff-Only Content*

So you're multi logging on accounts now? lol

Upwards · May 24, 2023

This is actually just embarrassing at this point. I will continue purchasing accounts like I always have and I will get feedback as needed.

GENR · May 24, 2023

Upwards said:
So you're multi logging on accounts now? lol

Just the truth coming out which is not something you are not used to, man up and admit what you did was wrong and stop wasting everyone's time, you are undoing a sale that was done, it is embarrassing you continue to do this, and Attach you are flaming me and blackmailing me in Epicnpc DMs as well

get a grip on yourself Upwards

@EpicNPC CM

Upwards · May 24, 2023

That isn't black mail and you flamed me as well. You are so delusional dude just stop LOL

Upwards · May 24, 2023

I'm done responding, seriously.

You need to grow up and grow a pair.

The Integrity · May 24, 2023

I went through the chat.

Timeline:
- Upwards buys AGS Pure ("acc1") for $220 via Paypal and the deal goes smooth.
- New deal to trade in acc1 and add $280 in LTC which must be paid in two $140 parts within a month for Infernal Pure ("acc2").
- Upwards gives back acc1 and gets partial access to acc2. Only password, email when paid in full - Upwards is fine with this.
- Upwards claims that Ginger is "hounding" him for money. He requests either a refund or reversal of second trade only. Ginger claims that he just asked calmly. (chat)
- Ginger wants to stick to the original deal since he gave acc1 to his friend but after ~7 mins agrees to give back acc1. (chat)
- Upwards no longer wants that and insists only on complete tradeback of both trades.
- Ginger reasonably refuses. Upwards forces a trade back. Gave back acc2 and opened a dispute on Paypal.

Current status:
- Ginger has both accounts back.
- Paypal dispute is still opened. Upwards wants his money back.

Based on the chat Upwards forced a trade back. For this, negative feedback can be given.
I don't really see what Ginger said as money "hounding" and can't justify the reasoning. It's possible that you interpreted his messages differently and this caused a spiral of misunderstanding.

Regardless of whose fault is it, Ginger cannot keep both the accounts and money. The money on Paypal must be returned to Upwards.

@EpicNPC CM
Please remove all 4 negative feedback that they exchanged:

https://www.epicnpc.com/feedback/feedback/756522/view
https://www.epicnpc.com/feedback/feedback/757809/view
https://www.epicnpc.com/feedback/feedback/757481/view
https://www.epicnpc.com/feedback/feedback/756375/view

Once money is returned, negative feedback can be given for a forced tradeback.

The Integrity · May 24, 2023

@Ginger told me that he's unable to add money due to the dispute.

@Upwards you can either close the dispute and have him refund the transaction normally, or wait for the dispute to get reviewed by paypal and close on it's own.

Upwards · May 24, 2023

The Integrity said:
@Ginger told me that he's unable to add money due to the dispute.

@Upwards you can either close the dispute and have him refund the transaction normally, or wait for the dispute to get reviewed by paypal and close on it's own.

The Integrity said:
Regardless of whose fault is it, Ginger cannot keep both the accounts and money. The money on Paypal must be returned to Upwards.

Paypal just needs him to refund it, I already was in contact with them today. Basically he is fighting it through them (not sure what he posted/said they wont tell me-- only mentioned he responded)

Not going to comment towards anything else you said, this has gone on long enough.. just going to accept negative feedback for a "forced trade back" and get my money back.
EDIT: For the negative feedback, it should only mention I forced a trade back, nothing about being a scammer because no scam took place. Just a forced trade back. Thanks

Basically, for my refund, he must go to Paypal and agree that accounts were returned and he will be able to refund me. I don't know the ins and outs of it but his account is delinquent solely based on the dispute I raised putting him into a negative balance.
@The Integrity @Ginger

GENR · May 24, 2023

Upwards said:
Paypal just needs him to refund it, I already was in contact with them today. Basically he is fighting it through them (not sure what he posted/said they wont tell me-- only mentioned he responded)

Not going to comment towards anything else you said, this has gone on long enough.. just going to accept negative feedback for a "forced trade back" and get my money back.
EDIT: For the negative feedback, it should only mention I forced a trade back, nothing about being a scammer because no scam took place. Just a forced trade back. Thanks

Basically, for my refund, he must go to Paypal and agree that accounts were returned and he will be able to refund me. I don't know the ins and outs of it but his account is delinquent solely based on the dispute I raised putting him into a negative balance.
@The Integrity @Ginger

Thank you @The Integrity for posting while I wasn't home, much-appreciated sir!

Hi @Upwards, I have nothing more to say to you, you have no grounds to dictate what I say in my feedback afterward, it will be clear cut and honest, you did try to steal money maliciously from me by making a false claim PayPal and committing fraud, in terms of the refund there is nothing more that can be done on my end as it is out of my control as you filed the dispute, I spoke to PayPal and they said the same thing that I have to wait for the dispute to be finished as it is "under review" as of now and this was also verified by @The Integrity

I hope this is a lesson learned @Upwards next time take a step back and think rationally and be patient instead of acting on impulse and emotions like a child.. I wish you the best in your future endeavors, whether you want to be honest or lie about what happened, it doesn't matter anymore as everything has already been proven and what you did was unethical, unprofessional, and disgusting. Sadly you are still here trying to justify your actions and it doesn't look good on you whatsoever as it shows you didn't learn anything or even care but it is not surprising to me.

A final note for the community, my mistake here was trusting this person and using PayPal, Always use TG and never use PayPal at all as you can see what happens when you are left vulnerable this is the result..

I will however not speak to you or associate with you in any way shape or form, you are not deserving of my time and I don't have any respect for a scammer/liar, all the best to you and I will keep all parties updated on the status of the refund unless @Upwards wants to cancel the dispute and I can refund him manually there is nothing that can be done.

Thank you to the staff once again for your patience in this lengthy ordeal, I tried to make it as painless as possible but our friend here had other plans, if anything else is needed please feel free to reach me @The Integrity @EpicNPC CM

Thank you,

All the best to everyone involved in this dispute and best wishes,

Ginger

Upwards · May 24, 2023

>gives accounts back
>wants money back (call it a forced trade)
>is a scammer and malicious intent of stealing money

Got it.

Upwards · May 24, 2023

@The Integrity I will keep you posted on the dispute until I get that refund.

Regardless of what anyone has to say here, I know there was no scam in place or malicious intent. I was honest upfront and told him what would happen. Label it as you please.
Giving you your items back and wanting my money back is no shape way or form a scam, and it never will be. Anyone who calls that a scam is unfortunately delusional and that's just that. I'm not here to prove myself for anyone because I'm still getting positive feedback because I never do chargebacks or refunds, you are the first. So I learned my lesson not to be pressured into deals and not to befriend anyone on this website.

GENR · May 24, 2023

Upwards said:
>gives accounts back
>wants money back (call it a forced trade)
>is a scammer and malicious intent of stealing money

Got it.

Upwards said:
@The Integrity I will keep you posted on the dispute until I get that refund.

Regardless of what anyone has to say here, I know there was no scam in place or malicious intent. I was honest upfront and told him what would happen. Label it as you please.
Giving you your items back and wanting my money back is no shape way or form a scam, and it never will be. Anyone who calls that a scam is unfortunately delusional and that's just that. I'm not here to prove myself for anyone because I'm still getting positive feedback because I never do chargebacks or refunds, you are the first. So I learned my lesson not to be pressured into deals and not to befriend anyone on this website.

Please stop spamming the thread with your nonsense @Upwards , your head is so far up your behind you don't even realize it.

Now, based on the ruling given by @The Integrity and other staff, you can be patient and wait until PayPal is done a review the dispute that YOU MADE, or you can close the dispute and I can have the money sent, whatever you want is your choice.

I will not entertain your BS anymore than I already have and need to for the sake of this dispute and staff, also for future reference, you need to learn to differentiate between "Business" and "feelings" and "friends" No one held a gun to your head and forced you to accept anything, you did it out of your own free will, so again, stop trying to justify your actions.

You also don't need to worry about anyone "befriending" you as no one will want to associate with you after what you have done for a while, so you have nothing to worry about there you were begging to buy irrelevant items just to get feedback to hide what you did instead of owning up to it like a man...

Anyways, if you have anything important to say go ahead otherwise stop spamming and posting because it doesn't help anyone or staff and I have better things to attend to than your childish immature behavior that has wasted everyone's time, now do yourself a favor and go open a dictionary because clearly, you need one.

Be patient until Paypal refunds you or closes the dispute, end of story, you are the only one to blame here and you are the only one who decided to open the false dispute in the first place, clearly, you are paranoid because of a previous incident that happened to you as you yourself told me before but not everyone here is bad or out to get you, get a grip of yourself!

I will not comment here anymore unless it is important or the staff requires it, once again, @Upwards you have two options, the choice is in your hands, goodbye.

Kind regards,

Ginger

Upwards · May 24, 2023

Ginger said:
Please stop spamming the thread with your nonsense @Upwards , your head is so far up your behind you don't even realize it.

Now, based on the ruling given by @The Integrity and other staff, you can be patient and wait until PayPal is done a review the dispute that YOU MADE, or you can close the dispute and I can have the money sent, whatever you want is your choice.

I will not entertain your BS anymore than I already have and need to for the sake of this dispute and staff, also for future reference, you need to learn to differentiate between "Business" and "feelings" and "friends" No one held a gun to your head and forced you to accept anything, you did it out of your own free will, so again, stop trying to justify your actions.

You also don't need to worry about anyone "befriending" you as no one will want to associate with you after what you have done for a while, so you have nothing to worry about there you were begging to buy irrelevant items just to get feedback to hide what you did instead of owning up to it like a man...

Anyways, if you have anything important to say go ahead otherwise stop spamming and posting because it doesn't help anyone or staff and I have better things to attend to than your childish immature behavior that has wasted everyone's time, now do yourself a favor and go open a dictionary because clearly, you need one.

Be patient until Paypal refunds you or closes the dispute, end of story, you are the only one to blame here and you are the only one who decided to open the false dispute in the first place, clearly, you are paranoid because of a previous incident that happened to you as you yourself told me before but not everyone here is bad or out to get you, get a grip of yourself!

I will not comment here anymore unless it is important or the staff requires it, once again, @Upwards you have two options, the choice is in your hands, goodbye.

Kind regards,

Ginger

Do you feel good after posting paragraphs LOL

GENR · May 25, 2023

I spoke to Paypal, and had it manually done by them, @Upwards has been fully refunded: total refunded is $220, $211.56 by me and the rest was by Paypal

@The Integrity @EpicNPC CM

The Integrity · May 25, 2023

@Upwards Please confirm that you have received the refund.
And you won't be labeled a scammer and the feedback would clearly only mention trade back.

Upwards · May 25, 2023

The Integrity said:
@Upwards Please confirm that you have received the refund.
And you won't be labeled a scammer and the feedback would clearly only mention trade back.

*Staff-Only Content*

Upwards · May 25, 2023

The Integrity said:
And you won't be labeled a scammer and the feedback would clearly only mention trade back.

@Ginger

The Integrity · May 25, 2023

He can't reply because you blocked him

Upwards · May 25, 2023

The Integrity said:
He can't reply because you blocked him

Just reiterate to him on the premise of him saying "I don't dictate what he puts on my feedback" he can only list I forced a tradeback and that I am not a scammer. Other wise it's false feedback. Thanks pal

EpicNPC CM · May 25, 2023

The Integrity said:
@Upwards Please confirm that you have received the refund.
And you won't be labeled a scammer and the feedback would clearly only mention trade back.

Only staff can view this content.
Click to expand...

The Integrity · May 25, 2023

Closing as resolved. All exchanged feedbacks were removed and Upwards was given a negative feedback for forced tradeback.

In case the refund on Paypal does not complete you can message me, but please first give it at least a week to process. Do not give feedback again regarding this particular deal.

False Feedback by Delusional 12 Year Old

Level 65

Level 65

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