At what point does a website become complicit in scams/fraud?

[i3ond]

Okay, lets have a hypothetical discussion.

You have a website that acts as middle man and the website claims it "guarantees that the seller will deliver your order, or your money back"

Except roughly 5-7% of orders are not delivered. Even though the seller claims 100% of orders are delivered.

So you open a dispute. You didn't receive anything but now the burden of proof is on your shoulders to prove that you Did NOT receive your order.

Even though the website clearly states "we guarantees that the seller will deliver your order, or your money back"

Since it's nearly impossible to prove that something did not happen in games, you lose all the money you paid.

If you open a legal or paypal dispute they will suspend you from their website with all access. Even though you did nothing wrong, you just wanted them to fullfil their guarantee.


So how many times does this same situation have to re-occur before the website is banned from promoting on epicnpc and the user account is also banned ?

IF they rip off 100 people a year, is that enough?

 

[Adoxia]

If you prove a scam against the website and have evidence that the website itself did the scam and not the seller then the website owner would be banned on epic. Epicnpc has a zero tolerance for scamming even if it's by a major website.

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In my opinion I'd recommend not selling on that site anymore. It is a very flawed system to make a buyer show proof that the seller did not send anything. The seller should have to show proof that they sent something. "We guarantee the seller sends you the order, or your money back" would also be false advertisement if they are making the buyer prove that the seller sent something.

 

[i3ond]

If you prove a scam against the website and have evidence that the website itself did the scam and not the seller then the website owner would be banned on epic. Epicnpc has a zero tolerance for scamming even if it's by a major website.

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In my opinion I'd recommend not selling on that site anymore. It is a very flawed system to make a buyer show proof that the seller did not send anything. The seller should have to show proof that they sent something. "We guarantee the seller sends you the order, or your money back" would also be false advertisement if they are making the buyer prove that the seller sent something.

Your right, but is this a bannable offence on epic? Should this website be allowed to promote itself even though they do all of the above consistently without remorse or attempting of correcting?

 

[Adoxia]

Epicnpc can't ban that offence due to there being no evidence, I believe I know which website you are speaking of and lots of people have issues with it. However, the way they are doing it blocks evidence and without proof of scam they can't be banned sadly.

 

[EpicNPC]

It's up to the website to create rules and guidelines for sales and if there's a problem, to update those rules so the same thing doesn't keep happening. In your example, there's not enough information to say one way or another.

If you purchased something and didn't get it, what procedure does the site have in place to make a determination of what happened?

If the site requires the seller to take screenshots of the exchange in-game, then there should be some evidence the seller can submit that shows they did deliver the item.
If the site requires no proof, then I don't know how they can provide any guarantee.

I'm my opinion, if the seller can't prove they gave something to the buyer, then they didn't give anything. Even a chat showing in-game usernames were exchange and a meetup spot selected shows intent to deliver.

In this hypothetical situation, we don't know what proof the seller gave the website if any, so it would be very hard to determine how they arrived at their decision.

 

[i3ond]

In this hypothetical situation, lets say Buyers will not be refunded if

"

you weren't able to prove that the seller did NOT deliver"

.
And that proof must be a

"We need a clear screenshot of evidence from the transaction that you received with the time stamp. Details must specified as well."

I realize that doesn't make sense, but this is just a hypothetical.

basically if you fail to prove the seller did not deliver with a clear screenshot of evidence from the transaction that you received(did not receive?) with the time stamp. Details must specified as well. Your dispute will be automatically denied and your payment is forfeit, any negative feedback you left for the seller will be removed and any chance of further disputing with be denied.


Any other method of proving the delivery did not happen would not be acceptable. That would include pointing out messages on the website between buyer and seller. Providing undeniable inaccuracies in the sellers evidence, such as photoshoping screenshots, wrong buyers account name, wrong race/class of character, attempt to scam ingame and threats to hack buyers account?

How many time would it need to be proven that the website allowed this to happen in order for Epicnpc to ban the person from the forums?






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On a Similar note, please view this dispute

https://www.epicnpc.com/threads/1232195-Several-Hundred-Reasons-to-Ban-PlayerAuctions-in-2017

 

[EpicNPC]

Okay, I'll take a look and will reply there.